Discord is valued at 1.65 _billion_ dollars.

What kind of person can look at that and go "ah, yes, this free chat service is totally not gonna screw us out of private data for profit"?

@spacekookie licensing all the content you're uploading there to discord, what could possibly go wrong :'D (the ToS screenshot is older since I tried to bringing up that topic to artists I'm friend with who started using discord after that Tumblr thingy)

@spacekookie @rachel I think that's for distributing images etc over the platform etc iirc

tech pol / thread is important to artists and original content creators 

@rachel @spacekookie

here is a link to terms of service for sources sake

my heart is palipatating

tech pol / thread is important to artists and original content creators 

@lugh @rachel @spacekookie When you include the part immediately before that, it gets even worse!

"It's your responsibility if anything goes wrong but we're allowed to do whatever we want with it."

Yep. This is totally fair. 😒

tech pol / thread is important to artists and original content creators 

@KitsuneAlicia @rachel @spacekookie yea like, im gonna start encouraging and helping art communities translocate to cyber spaces that let us be more autonomous with our content

@rachel @spacekookie How could they run the service without something like that licence? Not sure about the “perpetual” bit, probably just lawyers being cautious, but all the rest is what they're there to do.

@edavies @rachel @spacekookie they can't. there's a reason this is standard in EVERY online service tos.

@kauko Bullshit! They don't "need" a license to "adapt, modify, publish, create derivative work of" users' content (it's probably illegal in Europe). All they need is to host it.

They don't need a "perpetual license", and it's not "just lawyers being cautious". Cautious lawyers would know that perpetual clause is illegal in Europe (The "right to be forgotten", the GRDP.).

And it's NOT in "EVERY online service tos".

@edavies @rachel @spacekookie

@kauko The reason why it's on every online proprietary, centralized, for-profit service tos, has a name: surveillance capitalism.

@edavies @rachel @spacekookie

that "private data", at least from me, includes a lot of stuff that never happened. for example, i do not own two boats and/or a soccer club in Iceland.

@spacekookie most probably, yes. Although there are a lot of paying users for premium features, and they also distribute games now.

@deathy The few people actually buying a subscription aren't paying for server costs though

@spacekookie @deathy Not only paying for servers, but also salaries AND dividends for their shareholders. Including Tencent (owner of wechat, and helped the Chinese gov to spy on wechat users)

In 2015 or 2016, discord pretended they don't sell data and their business model is selling goodies… Sure, seems legit, you pay salaries, dividends and servers/nertwork fees, by selling stickers and pins. The lamest excuse I ever heard 🤦‍♂️

@spacekookie Many users, not reading ToS and thinking "There's no reason for them to sell our data, they said they won't!"

@spacekookie Yeah, exactly. The "My private life is not so important to be spied on " kind of excuse.

Or even worse, "I don't care, I have nothing to hide because I'm not a criminal/terrorist"

The same kind of person who thinks "I don't have anything to hide" when confronted with the reality of the mass online surveillance and invasion of privacy by the NSA.

@spacekookie Is that a stock value? Because if so that's really only what stock market people think it's worth.
And their privacy problems really suck because the software works well and doesn't feel like Linux support is an afterthought.

@kmckaig No, it's not a stock value. It's their evaluation value from the VC funding rounds they do. It's how venture capitalist estimate what horse to back because it'll make them vast amounts of cash back

@spacekookie How do they arrive at that number I wonder? Because it still feels like a speculative thing...

@kmckaig Oh, it's entirely speculative 😂

My point is: some people with a lot of money think that Discord will make them over a billion dollars back.
Let's all think about what that means...

Not that I really agree, but the argument is that they have other revenue streams so they won't have to rely on selling your data.

@spacekookie what is the recommended alternative? Mattermost? Something matrix-based?

@e8johan mattermost is pretty nice. For ccc event planning we use a rocket which is also cool. Either of those are good choices

@spacekookie Hello, here's a somewhat recent source (dec 2018) indicating it is now more than **2** billion (apparently the 1.65 billion dates from this summer?):

@spacekookie personally I never tried this platform (used to have a xmpp server, now using my own mattermost instance with close firends), but I feel a bit unconfortable that discord as a platform is being pushed by e.g. rustlang as a community platform:

Don't see why they can't use mattermost, or even zulip (never tried that one, though) that was proposed as alternative.

@spacekookie i mean they make it a huge pain in the ass to access gdpr data

@spacekookie or future advertising revenue perhaps, but advertisers usually want demographics etc so :-/

@spacekookie It's not so much that they're worth a lot as it is that the marginal value of a dollar to a VC who also has a huge number of other highly risky investments is a 1/1.65e9 Discords based on the 50% chance that some future investor will value their marginal dollar even less relative to Discords.

@spacekookie I have been moving off it slowly. It's a shame that so many people rely on Discord to contact me. 🤔

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