Today I was bummed to find out that the Purism Librem 5 phone likely won't be able to run apps like Wire or Signal -- the company calls them "walled gardens", adding "their server software is proprietary."

For encrypted comms, they write, "Matrix is the proper solution and that is why we have partnered with them."

That isn't surprising.

Purism's distribution also removes _all_ proprietary bits, even going so far as to use linux-libre.

Hope is not yet lost though. It's possible some nerd will make a client for it on the Librem 5.

@nixy @schlink Weren't they going to make an Android compatibility layer at some point?

Sounds about right. Always found signal suspicious and Moxie's argument for centralization and proprietary server bogus

@jonkroe @schlink Same. Sigh. I'm really gonna have to try to switch everyone I know off Signal, aren't I.

@schlink no official Signal app, but another volunteer is working on a Signal app/port for it.

@schlink Gosh, sure, when I think about security from a gardening perspective, the very first thing I want is no walls so just anyone can come in to look at and trample my plants

@schlink That's weird, and a shame cause Wire seems to be planning to document how to setup private instances and federation . The android client even seems to be gnu gpl-3


cc: @micahflee
since you're also 'pushing' for signal, you might like to read the above post about the decision @Purism related to this took.

@paulfree14 @schlink @Purism that's an interesting decision to not base it on Android Open Source Project! The Signal server and protocol is actually totally open:

But it is centralized and doesn't federate. However, that also means it's way simpler to create an account, find other users, and to use yourself. I like Riot too, but I don't think I'll stop using Signal any time soon.

@micahflee @paulfree14 @schlink @Purism
i'm also very much pushing for signal, and it has been a great success.
The #Librem5 not supporting #signal is going to become a huge problem for me, as all my contacts are on there.

@Maltimore @micahflee @paulfree14 @schlink @Purism wire, signal and others are free to develop apps to Librem. Hopefully Librem will get something like anbox running on it.

@Maltimore @micahflee @paulfree14 @schlink @Purism

There might not be an official support, but writing a client for the Librem 5 definitely is feasible. The signal-cli project is a good foundation for a client.


If I recall correctly there was some code missing for voice calls. 🤔

But apart from that: Matrix is by far not on the level of Signal when it comes to security. Cloud stored messages, expiring messages, end2end encryption by default, reliable crypto,… there is so much left to do in Matrix that right now taking it as replacement for Signal is not practical.

@paulfree14 @schlink @Purism

@sheogorath @Purism @schlink @paulfree14 @micahflee The e2ee in Matrix needs improvement. Currently I don't consider it practical.
@schlink I approve of Purism's decision there.

Walled garden systems with a single centralized server run by some guy are something we should reject.
@bob @bobjonkman While I'm still awaiting #Wire's promised federation, #Matrix is still problematic because of the way their E2EE works.

Could there be a funding source that influenced #Purism's decision?

@schlink To be fair, you should be able to flash any ARM-based Linux distro on it and then install Signal on that, if you want.

@schlink I believe their statement is valid and do endorse it.

@schlink you want proprietary apps on a freedom phone? smdh
@schlink you might have better luck with an open phone

purism is chugging too much FSF coolaid to let anything that isn't free software on their phones
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