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Guile and Racket are the two schemey languages I think are most "production ready". I'm still very interested in "whatever Scheme-in-the-browser" seems most viable first.

I'm hoping Guile does that soon, but I'd also take any r7rs scheme.

Scheme.Wasm and Schism are promising.

@meganeko Clojure's license sucks, its lead dev exploded its community, and needing to pull in the JVM to my build pipeline is still unappealing to me.

@meganeko Clojure did a lot of innovative things, it's had a wide influence on the adoption of functional datastructures. I know people who have loved it. I've still never seen someone absolutely sabotage a painstakingly built community the way Rich Hickey did though, holy shit

@cwebber @meganeko what… did he do?
I kinda lost track of clojure and its community because work and life took over time allocated to FLOSS

@cwebber Andy Wingo has been working a lot on Wasm lately, and he has dropped in the idea that Guile should work in the browser. So fingers crossed.

(Btw he just fired off three very interesting blogposts garbage collection - another part of Guile he's working on. They went waaay over the top of my head.)

wingolog.org/

@acousticmirror Yup, Wingo and I have talked about this. He agrees the WASM stuff is important but is more personally excited about the GC stuff atm. But the GC stuff might help the WASM compilation effort, is my understanding.

Wingo's talk "Compiling Webassembly: Notes from the Trenches" is a spectacular watch, btw. archive.fosdem.org/2021/schedu

@cwebber Oh, thanks! That might have been the source I was talking about, but I didn't really get deep into it. I'll check it out - every Wingo post or talk is worth taking long notes and thinking a lot about what's at stake.

@meena Ah. Well, it's still a compiled language... though it doesn't produce standalone static binaries on its own, that's true. (It does use the ELF format though...!)

However, I think Wingo's blogpost "Webassembly: the new Kubernetes?" is exactly what you mean wingolog.org/archives/2021/12/

@cwebber @meena honestly are there any languages these days which aren't compiled? other than purely pedagogical ones i mean

@technomancy @cwebber I think i did the old mistake of conflating a single executable with compilation

@cwebber

I don't know how relevan't this is, but there's always BiwaScheme[1], although it's more of a Scheme-on-top-of-JS. But you can make stuff with it right now, though.

[1]: biwascheme.org/

@cwebber js is already a dialect of Scheme, it just has a weird syntax 🙃.

Seriously though a scheme-ish language that compiles to js wouldn't be hard to make, I'm amazed if nobody has done that already.

@w96k Yeah there's a lot of good Schemes out there! Mostly "ready for production" has less to do with speed (which Chez mostly wins on) but "able to get a significant amount of work done in, commit to as a platform"

@w96k Racket is currently the most productive Scheme, yeah. The other thing that makes Guile very useful and worth considering is Guix!

@w96k @cwebber What I want to see now is the javascript on guile thingie. I may work on it just to laugh at JS like: "look what they need to do mimic a fraction of our power"

@w96k @ekaitz_zarraga It's not fully lost, but not prioritizeed. @ArneBab's Wisp is a nice surface-syntax approach to that. Robin Templeton's work on emacs lisp is also great, really due for a revival. But yes. Guile's compiler tower is very cool, but also sadly neglected in terms of the priority we give it.

We should be promoting it more, using it more!

@w96k @ekaitz_zarraga @ArneBab That said, having spent time in Racket-land, it's possible to get TOO addicted to providing a good language development experience. I'd argue Racket has done just that; many things are which should really be libraries. Scheme's extensibility means that schemers need it less often.

@cwebber I don’t think it’s fully baked yet (and I haven’t tried it), but Racket’s Chez fork can run on WASM via Emscripten!

@LiberalArtist @cwebber In the video of one of the big Racket meetings facilitated by Matt Flatt the old German guy said something like "Before Web Assembly realizes all of our dreams..." I was wondering what he meant by that. If WASM lets me put some plot scripts on-line so people can paste in their own data and alter views in ways that make sense to them... It might contribute towards Racket/Scheme serving as the "core of a liberal arts" curriculum.

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