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I've realised a few things about tootstorming.

1. It's ... possibly frighteningly ... fun. Once you get on a roll, you're marshalling your thoughts in 500 character, roughly 80-word, nuggest.

2. That's about the same size as one of my 4x6 index cards, filled out fully.

3. Which means it's a bit like outlining an essay, though of course, Timelines and stuff mean that everything is strictly sequential.

4. People can respond to individual cards, either boosting, favouriting, or commenting.

@dredmorbius About tweetstorms, politics and gender:

Someone coined the term "mantreading" when several male tweeps discussed US politics via tweetstorm, but this might miss the point. Tweetstorms have always been popular among female users as well (and they might have invented the technique):

@stefanieschulte Interesting article. Though I've got a whole bushel of problems with terms like "mansplaining" and "manthreading" being tossed around casually. Even /where/ accurate, they are terms which have a great deal of opportunity to make a situation worse, and little to improve, defuse, or prevent it.

That's not a denial of privilege or behaviour, but its /also/ a reflection on dynamics of such discussions. There's an essay on the topic I may need to write.

The thread/form bits...

@dredmorbius I think "mansplaining" is more about the receiver than about the sender: Most people seem to be much more patient when men act that way than when women try the same. In real life, I have a tendency to ramble, too, but people usually interrupt me quickly.

I don't think this is the same in social media: Women's tweetstorms don't seem to be received less favourably than men's, at least in my experience.

@stefanieschulte Specific instance comes to mind: someone had posted about a gym/workout issue, being worse at a particular lift than they wanted to be. I responded with some pretty commonplace, though effective, advice. I'd had no idea if the poster was a man or a woman, and didn't much care, I'd followed them for a year or more. The response was that I was "mansplaining'.

I pointed out the several issues with the claim, and tried to return the matter to workouts. It didn't stay there.

@stefanieschulte At which point I elected to delete my contributions to the thread and block the user.

If the first assumption coming out of the gate is that some pseudonymous profile writing in good faith is mansplaining...then productive discussion seems unlikely to happen. I don't have the cycles for that fight.

I've been trying really hard not to cheer loudly in agreement with @maiyannah's recent thread about the privilege knapsack. But her views are refreshing.

JollyOrc @JollyOrc

@dredmorbius @stefanieschulte one of the often overlooked problems with mansplaining and other -ist behaviour is that it ruins every other interaction too.

From the outside, actual helpful advise can look a lot like mansplaining.

So if you constantly get things mansplained, and in comes a man explaining things, regardless of how sane and innocent that was, _of course_ he's a nasty mansplainer too!

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@JollyOrc @dredmorbius Yes, and it's sometimes the nicer people getting the heat, because facing the real bullies is (often objectively) risky. I think people who point out that they aren't the worst offenders, or that they didn't intend any harm, sometimes miss this point.

Of course, there are probably toxic people who intentionally accuse others of sexism or racism simply in order to stir up trouble (but they are a minority, I think).

@stefanieschulte @dredmorbius There are two points in there I like to expand on, plus a third that occurs to me: 1. If you offended, apologize. You may then decide that you don't need more interaction with a person that is, from your POV too easily offended, but that doesn't change the fact that you politely apologize and back off.

2. There are indeed few real trolls. Still enough to stir up trouble.

3. often overlooked fact: Men can mansplain to other men too!

@JollyOrc @stefanieschulte So, I'm a Gresham's Law fettishist, and you've just given a Gresham's Law of Perceived Conversational Bias.

Let's see if I can't codify that: Insensitive, presumptive, and condescending conversation drives out sensitive, considerate, and supportive conversation.

Good? Fixes?


@dredmorbius @stefanieschulte Sums it up.

The only fix I can come up with is to make bad interpersonal behaviour non-rewarding. (where the trick is to figure out what the "reward" here is. Attention, even negative, can be a reward. As can "getting away with it" be. So if you think that someone feels rewarded by column a, but it's actually column b, you're in deep trouble)

@JollyOrc @stefanieschulte Which reduces to a fundamental problem: incentivisation is hard.

If the behaviour comes from a position of power, and that power can be removed, that's an option.

If it comes from a position of /lack/ of power, or more specifically, /responsibility/, then giving a small measure of responsibility may help address this. See what it is to actually have to /work with others/ in order to /achieve/ something.

@stefanieschulte @JollyOrc That's from the "the best way to earn trust is to give it" school. Key is to structure that so as not to risk too much, though you will have to risk something.

@stefanieschulte @JollyOrc Removing other triggers -- fear, concern, etc. -- and making clear when the behaviour /is/ acceptable, is another tactic I've used with some success.

Though other cases are just hard.

@JollyOrc @dredmorbius @stefanieschulte tl;dr not all men's explaining things comes from assumption others are stupid; and we really don't have a crystal bowl that would tell us "this person knows this already".

Also, I am very tempted to change my avatar and nick here to something looking vaguelly non-male non-white and do some serious mansplaining, and observe the difference in reactions.

/me ducks expecting a tootstorm

@rysiek @JollyOrc @dredmorbius
> Also, I am very tempted to change my avatar and nick here to something looking vaguelly non-male non-white and do some serious mansplaining, and observe the difference in reactions.

Some people tried something similar, and their experience was... interesting:

@stefanieschulte @JollyOrc @dredmorbius ah yes, I've seen this. My point is to do it the otehr way around. I am not saying sexism is not a problem - it is. But my feel is that last couple of times when I was called a mansplainer, had I had a non-male non-white avatar, the reaction would have been different. I would like to test this.